Clarification regarding language on public channel

Nostalrius official announcements

Re: Clarification regarding language on public channel

by Blazzy » Sat Jan 23, 2016 2:54 pm

There needs to be a 2nd PVP server with free xfers at the start opened, with either xrealms at the start or eventually.

The reason a population cap won't work is the population here will continue to grow, especially when AQ comes out. If they capped it at 5-6k people online today, more than half the player base would have tried to log in and been hit with a 5-7k position in Q to login...that would destroy the server more than it would help it.

They've shown they can add another server, just need to split this one and create a 2nd PVP server.
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Re: Clarification regarding language on public channel

by Sharax » Sat Jan 23, 2016 2:58 pm

I have no objections about playing with people from different countries. It is actually a cool thing to be a part of an international server. My objection, however, is playing with people who are unable to communicate in the official language of the server. If you can't speak English, I don't care if you're from China, Russia, Bulgaria, Brazil or wherever - you detract from my play experience.

Suggesting that non-English speakers create their own private channel if they are in a BG is asinine. You're encouraging a split in the community (which is already here regardless due to the language issue). Cleaning up the public channels doesn't solve for this. Allowing non-English clients encourages non-English players to come here on the so-called official English server.
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Re: Clarification regarding language on public channel

by mozibake » Sat Jan 23, 2016 3:20 pm

I feel the need to point out that Chinese is not fully logographic, and that in your attempt to be politically correct and avoid singling out any one group you have made a factual error. It is only partially logographic, with most hanzi being composed either of a ideographic component that indicates meaning and a phonetic component that indicates pronunciation, or of two or more ideographic components indicating an abstract meaning. [My favorite is 妬, being 女(woman) and 石(stone/gem) and meaning "jealousy"]

Also, the supposed fix doesn't even work, I'm still seeing /bg flooded with blank lines.
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Re: Clarification regarding language on public channel

by snawfu » Sat Jan 23, 2016 5:19 pm

This would be a really good opportunity for the K server to repopulate itself by allowing a character copy from here for all the players fed up with nihao.

I'd do it.


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Re: Clarification regarding language on public channel

by canitnerd » Sat Jan 23, 2016 6:02 pm

Soyoen wrote:
canitnerd wrote:
Soyoen wrote:Granted, it would probably be a good idea to provide them with a server of their own - but in the name of racism that would imply that every region (EU/NA/.../CHINA) should get their own server.

The bandaid solution the community is asking for (a second pvp server) is mediocre at best, do you honestly believe that no chineese players would start over at that realm as well? Unless there are free transfers whilst having the same timeline as the original realm AND being EU/NA restricted (this wont happen), it wont make a dent in the population showing on Nostalrius PvP.[/color]


There is no "racism" here. The FACT of the matter is most Chinese players do not speak English, either because of inability or choice. Meanwhile, most euro/NA players DO speak English. Because Vanilla WoW is a game that entirely relies on players interacting with each other, and because a huge portion of the player base is incapable of interacting meaningfully with the rest of it, it makes sense to solve the overpopulation issue by splitting these populations up. Make a second server, open free transfers to it. Ping lock the main server. Problems solved.

What makes sense is not always the optimal solution in terms of management. Aside from that Nostalrius team has no real reason to remove the freedom of choice for one specific large part of their playerbase, if they open up another realm it will likely be available for all nationalities and countries. I'm not arguing that there are issues interacting with chinese players, hell I try to avoid them regardless of game due to my perceptions of playing with some of them throughout the past. Then again, I've had equally bad if not worse experiences with western kids.

I do agree that Vanilla WoW relies on players interacting with each other, but most of all the game is about building communities be it in terms of a server, guild, raid or party community. When you have a large server there is bound to be different subcommunities on the server, and all those who make the active choice of playing on such a large server needs to accept that not everyone will speak their language, be polite or follow their cultural core values. Regardless of that, these players should not have their choice to play on this server or any other server removed, unless they are repeatedly breaking the ToU.


Obviously, I would not mind a second PvP server as long as the content progression is on pair with the current PvP server, or faster than the PvE server.


We all agree that overpopulation is clearly a problem, and is getting worse all the time. The only way to solve this is either mass banning players (impossible and stupid) or making a second server to split the player base. How is the BEST decision not to take a the player base that is ALREADY split primarily into two large groups (Chinese and English speakers) and give each their own server? This is a win/win, the only people who could possibly be upset over this change are the gold sellers.

Say you make a second server that isn't specifically targeted at Chinese players, but instead merely server two. Even if you assume that we live in a perfect world and the population of the two PVP servers become equal, we are now left with two servers and four communities. English players on server one have 3k people to play with, but have to deal with 6k populations. Chinese speakers on server two have 3k people to play with, but have to deal with 6k populations. Splitting the servers by language gives the best play experience to all involved.
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Re: Clarification regarding language on public channel

by Soyoen » Sat Jan 23, 2016 10:51 pm

canitnerd wrote:
Soyoen wrote:
canitnerd wrote:There is no "racism" here. The FACT of the matter is most Chinese players do not speak English, either because of inability or choice. Meanwhile, most euro/NA players DO speak English. Because Vanilla WoW is a game that entirely relies on players interacting with each other, and because a huge portion of the player base is incapable of interacting meaningfully with the rest of it, it makes sense to solve the overpopulation issue by splitting these populations up. Make a second server, open free transfers to it. Ping lock the main server. Problems solved.

What makes sense is not always the optimal solution in terms of management. Aside from that Nostalrius team has no real reason to remove the freedom of choice for one specific large part of their playerbase, if they open up another realm it will likely be available for all nationalities and countries. I'm not arguing that there are issues interacting with chinese players, hell I try to avoid them regardless of game due to my perceptions of playing with some of them throughout the past. Then again, I've had equally bad if not worse experiences with western kids.

I do agree that Vanilla WoW relies on players interacting with each other, but most of all the game is about building communities be it in terms of a server, guild, raid or party community. When you have a large server there is bound to be different subcommunities on the server, and all those who make the active choice of playing on such a large server needs to accept that not everyone will speak their language, be polite or follow their cultural core values. Regardless of that, these players should not have their choice to play on this server or any other server removed, unless they are repeatedly breaking the ToU.


Obviously, I would not mind a second PvP server as long as the content progression is on pair with the current PvP server, or faster than the PvE server.


We all agree that overpopulation is clearly a problem, and is getting worse all the time. The only way to solve this is either mass banning players (impossible and stupid) or making a second server to split the player base. How is the BEST decision not to take a the player base that is ALREADY split primarily into two large groups (Chinese and English speakers) and give each their own server? This is a win/win, the only people who could possibly be upset over this change are the gold sellers.

Say you make a second server that isn't specifically targeted at Chinese players, but instead merely server two. Even if you assume that we live in a perfect world and the population of the two PVP servers become equal, we are now left with two servers and four communities. English players on server one have 3k people to play with, but have to deal with 6k populations. Chinese speakers on server two have 3k people to play with, but have to deal with 6k populations. Splitting the servers by language gives the best play experience to all involved.


You seem to be void of the logistical nightmare of what a split would cause for the management of the servers. Splitting the servers according to language would incline that Nostalrius has different official languages, which in turn creates a need for communication and management activities conducted by individuals with chinese language capabilities. Hence what makes sense is not always the optimal solution from a management perspective.

Mass banning is not a serious option, force moving characters depending on nationality should never even be considered looking at how it recently turned out for other projects. Splitting the server based on language capabilities require a huge time, resource and knowledge investment for the Nostalrius team, which of course if they pulled it out with success would be very impressive.

If Nostalrius splits the servers based on language capabilities I'd favour a low queue setting where a monthly donation grants access to skip the queue, then this project would finally be completely "Blizzlike". Of course if we all act entitled and yell for change as I'm sure that will come, or you could apply to assist the server staff and offer your help. Regardless, as long as this realm operates with these high levels of consumers, it is bound to act with a goods-dominant market logic - in other words your bargaining power as a consumer will be very limited.
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Re: Clarification regarding language on public channel

by Sharax » Sat Jan 23, 2016 11:19 pm

If you do create another server, I would have one support non-English clients, while the other does not. Hopefully, that would act as enough encouragement to have non-English players go to the server that supports their language client.
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Re: Clarification regarding language on public channel

by canitnerd » Sat Jan 23, 2016 11:31 pm

It would not be a logistical nightmare. Have one server that is ping locked to sub ~400 ping, one that isn't. Continue the same kind of support and policies we have now. The chinese playerbase is entirely contained on the nonPinglocked server, while the English speaking player base plays on the ping locked server. Both player bases enjoy a better server population and only playing with others who should be able to speak their language, while the chinese player base is no worse off due to lack of support, because they are already unsupported.
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Re: Clarification regarding language on public channel

by Destillia » Sun Jan 24, 2016 12:13 pm

Man... was hoping for them to only allow English clients or something, that'd be a good filter for huge china population aswell.
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