How will Ret Pallies justify their raid spot?

[Theloras]

yea my bad I got confused by your post, since you quoted my sentence about the glancing blow stuff.
As for JoC, isn't it simply a ranged ability? It's basically the same mechanic as arcane shot by the hunter. deals magic damage, scales at 43%, as an instant spell, uses physical crit/hit(?), crits for 100% damage

Also I'm not really doing this to be a pain in the ass, rather just because the false bug report you just linked. It isn't the first I've seen regarding paladins

The problem with Judgement of Command here on Nost is that it is behaving similarly to Hammer of Wrath as I posted earlier - we are getting partial resists even in PvP against level 60 players.

I think we are also getting partial resists on Seal of Command as well in PvP but can't remember for sure.

I don't mind answering questions from people who legitimately want to know how Paladins functioned in Vanilla so no worries there.

[smilkovpetko]

Yes i'm not denying there are bugs affecting you negatively, but I also think there is some misinformation being spread, like now duki's interpretation of the french guy video on golemagg.

Duki has some complicated theory about seal of command following glancing blow rule but being recorded as partial resist.

To me it seems rather clear.

Seal of command: special melee ability, does not produce glancing blows.
Will miss, get parried and dodged, maybe blocked (?), uses melee hit n crit.
Does magic damage, and is thus mitigated by resistances. There is no holy resist, exept level based partial resists, which will cause partial resist against higher level targets.

Abilities are classifed as either spells or melee/ranged abilities
Mitigation is another thing: armor or magic defenses

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovhRqAxnXqg

0:55 = 1067 crit (178 resist) = 14.5.+% = 1245 full amount of damage - Seal of Command - without magma
1:32 = 476 dmg (159 resist) = 25% = 635 full amount of damage - Seal of Command - with magma
1:56 = 380 dmg (63 resist) = 14.5.+% = 443 full amount of damage - Judgement of Command - without mag
2:02 = 322 dmg (321 resist) = 50% = 643 full amount of damage - Seal of Command - with magma
2:07 = 163 dmg (54 resist) = 25% = 217 full amount of damage - Judgement of Command - with magma
2:26 = 262 dmg (87 resist) = 25% = 349 full amount of damage - Judgement of Command - with magma

http://forums.elitistjerks.com/forums/t ... -since-19/
Posted 14 Apr 2006

I believe partial resists on Seal of Command come from the combat log misinterpreting glancing blows. Although Seal of Command damage is holy based, it follows all melee rules and thus you would encounter some glancing blows(or partial resist in your combat log).

strange where you can see that damage was reduced only during magma splash effect only .
when person didn't had magma splash , he was doing 14.5 (because it is little more than 14.5 it counts as 15)
15% is actual human glancing blow damage reduce

[Softarunt]

yeah those numbers are wierd, I don't know anymore how this is supposed to be.

"Although Seal of Command damage is holy based, it follows all melee rules and thus you would encounter some glancing blows(or partial resist in your combat log"

If it did follow melee rules, and were subject to glancing blows, then crits shouldn't be reduced because attacks cannot be glancing blows and crits at the same time

[Theloras]

yeah those numbers are wierd, I don't know anymore how this is supposed to be.

Welcome to Retribution Paladins in Vanilla WoW

[Softarunt]

Actually I stumbled across a post explaining those numbers.

The reason is those are crits, and the resists happen before the crit roll, and then the remaining damage is doubled.

Take the JoC crit for 380 dmg, 63 resisted.

380 / 2 = 190
190+63 = 253
63 / 253 = 24.9%

Here's the quote and source

"Actually the combat log has the resist values displayed before amplification and crit bonus (which is an indicator on the ordering of computations they are doing).

You'll see entries like crit for 1650 (250 resisted). This could be for example shadowbolt with 2x crit multiplier and COS up. Normal hit would be 1000, but 25% got resisted. The remaining 750 gets amplified by x2 from crit and x1.1 from COS adding up to 1650."

http://forums.elitistjerks.com/forums/t ... ent=237467


So yeah, the resists on SoC and JoC are following normal partial resist rules, getting reduced by 25, 50 etc %.

Maybe there is some logic to the paladin after all =P

[Theloras]

Actually I stumbled across a post explaining those numbers.

The reason is those are crits, and the resists happen before the crit roll, and then the remaining damage is doubled.

Take the JoC crit for 380 dmg, 63 resisted.

380 / 2 = 190
190+63 = 253
63 / 253 = 24.9%

Here's the quote and source

"Actually the combat log has the resist values displayed before amplification and crit bonus (which is an indicator on the ordering of computations they are doing).

You'll see entries like crit for 1650 (250 resisted). This could be for example shadowbolt with 2x crit multiplier and COS up. Normal hit would be 1000, but 25% got resisted. The remaining 750 gets amplified by x2 from crit and x1.1 from COS adding up to 1650."

http://forums.elitistjerks.com/forums/t ... ent=237467


So yeah, the resists on SoC and JoC are following normal partial resist rules, getting reduced by 25, 50 etc %.

Maybe there is some logic to the paladin after all =P

Yes, SoC/JoC and HoW for that matter having partial resists against level 63 raid bosses it's fine but in PvP against level 60 Horde however...

Makes me sad in the pants

[smilkovpetko]

Actually I stumbled across a post explaining those numbers.

The reason is those are crits, and the resists happen before the crit roll, and then the remaining damage is doubled.

Take the JoC crit for 380 dmg, 63 resisted.

380 / 2 = 190
190+63 = 253
63 / 253 = 24.9%

Here's the quote and source

"Actually the combat log has the resist values displayed before amplification and crit bonus (which is an indicator on the ordering of computations they are doing).

You'll see entries like crit for 1650 (250 resisted). This could be for example shadowbolt with 2x crit multiplier and COS up. Normal hit would be 1000, but 25% got resisted. The remaining 750 gets amplified by x2 from crit and x1.1 from COS adding up to 1650."

http://forums.elitistjerks.com/forums/t ... ent=237467


So yeah, the resists on SoC and JoC are following normal partial resist rules, getting reduced by 25, 50 etc %.

Maybe there is some logic to the paladin after all =P

if it used to be like that , then explain the 14.5 damage resisted only when there is no magma splash? soon i will upload different paladin videos with this (as hit cap) , since the person with golemagg was not hit cap even.

[Softarunt]

Duki magla splash has nothing to do with it. Those just happen to be crits

[smilkovpetko]

Duki magla splash has nothing to do with it. Those just happen to be crits

1:56 = 380 dmg (63 resist) = 14.5.+% = 443 full amount of damage - Judgement of Command - without mag

this is not crit

[Softarunt]

Judgement of the crusader wears of just before. Trust me it is a crit, vengeance gets refreshed