Top DPS Class

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Re: Top DPS Class

by Theloras » Mon Nov 02, 2015 9:16 am

Killstick wrote:I think it’s kind of silly that you guys are debating Blazefury, Fiery Ret etc. The reason you have so little proof is because it is so hard to obtain them in the first place. Also the gear level required to make them worth it is high and you need to stack atleast a few of these items to make it work.

As of yet noone is using these items to great effect on the server. So it would be a waste of devtime to fix something which currently has so little impact. If they scaled in vanilla i think this is why Blizzard left them untouched. Because very few people actually had a chance to use /abuse it.
IMHO the items shouldn’t scale. I think it’s kinda silly if you see what these items can do if you let them scale (lol fire rogues). I can understand that some of you have the dream to become a raidboss ingame and on forum. But i don’t look forward to have 1 person using/abusing this just because he is lucky and because we have the knowledge now that they could scale. It's not like Tidal Charm or Skull of ID which everyone can get.

I’m looking for a Blizzlike experience and not a Blizzlike code perse. And that’s what this server is advertising. So learn the difference between these two and stop wasting devtime, forum space and your own time on stuff as trivial as this.


I couldn't agree more with you - unfortunately, Aethelwulf and now PriestInOurTime seem to have a hate on for me approaching stalking level...

As I've said before and I will say it here again - the only reason why Fire Rogues became an issue on Peenix was due to the vote/donation shop. By either using vote points or donating money, players had easy access to each of these items in question not to mention the ability to instantly purchase Naxxramas BiS forever cloth +spell dmg items to supplement the total fire dmg = Fire Rogues

But I want to highlight a very important point that you brought up when you said:

"If they scaled in vanilla i think this is why Blizzard left them untouched. Because very few people actually had a chance to use /abuse it."

This is exactly why once the cat was out of the bag on Peenix that Fire Rogues started to literally blow $hit up both in PvE and PvP with the help of the vote/donation shop as mentioned above.

That being said said both here and back on Peenix that if the Devs there and here decide to nerf the items for the betterment of each server then so be it. I'm merely trying to find an answer one way or the other and I wasn't able to based on the lack of evidence from Vanilla sources - hence why I contacted Blizzard directly.

PS Currently the gloves are only scaling at around 10% of total spell dmg (as was originally the case on Peenix) so they aren't "earth shattering" by any stretch of the imagination.
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Re: Top DPS Class

by smilkovpetko » Mon Nov 02, 2015 10:42 am

PriestInOurTime wrote:
smilkovpetko wrote:http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Darkmoon_Card:_Maelstrom

It is known to crit and may be affected by +spell damage

This is also item , but scale with +spell damage.[/i]


Also an item. Didn't scale with +spell damage. Would deal extra damage to any Nature Vulnerable mob.


maybe you should read much better in order to see that it is clearly saying that DMF Maelstrom is Item and "should scale" .

It is known to crit and may be affected by +spell damage (hits over 300 have occurred on non-vulnerable targets), and can be resisted normally as nature damage, it can also hit for 1000-1400 when the target is vulnerable to nature, in BWL for example.

p.s i remove my previous comments since they are offtopic like this one .
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Re: Top DPS Class

by PriestInOurTime » Mon Nov 02, 2015 12:43 pm

smilkovpetko wrote:maybe you should read much better in order to see that it is clearly saying that DMF Maelstrom is Item and "should scale" .


Maybe I'm not the one with a reading comprehension problem? That isn't what he says.

smilkovpetko wrote: It is known to crit and may be affected by +spell damage (hits over 300 have occurred on non-vulnerable targets), and can be resisted normally as nature damage, it can also hit for 1000-1400 when the target is vulnerable to nature, in BWL for example.


May = might = perhaps.

I went to the wiki, looked at the original post that first mentioned this. It came from a dude with 3 total edits to the wiki ever who noted that he saw 300 hits against what he thinks is non-vulnerable mobs speculated that "maybe it scales" and did no further testing. Before this, the wiki clearly states that it is not known to scale.

So, if it scales, how much? Oh right, mysteriously no one knows since the only one who ever guessed that it might scale with spell power didn't do any tests at all either to confirm or deny his hunch that it might scale. Also no one else found any scaling in the 1.5 years of vanilla where this was a fairly popular trinket.

Did no one ever teach you guys critical thinking skills? You are confirmation bias on legs. But, to be fair, this leaves a glimmer of hope for the hypothesis that the card scaled ever so slightly with spell power.

EDIT: So, I went digging a bit and found this:

http://www.wowhead.com/item=19289/darkm ... :id=150912
Lieandra wrote:Although the damage stated is from 200 to 300. This trinket is well capable of doing more than the stated 300.

I have had this go almost 400 that I have seen. Didn't think to take a picture till today. So if wowhead allows it. You will have a screenshot of over 300 for the Nature damage.


http://www.wowhead.com/npc=18564/horde- ... :id=147850
Lieandra wrote:I am lvl 62 - Rogue.


Those heavy spell power rogues, or just maybe it is something else rather than spell power scaling going on.
Pristine realms... Industrial levels of stupidity.
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Re: Top DPS Class

by smilkovpetko » Mon Nov 02, 2015 2:22 pm

-edited- by Killerduki

Offtopic discussion

(there is new topic regarding this discussion)

https://forum.nostalrius.org/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=25586
Last edited by smilkovpetko on Mon Nov 02, 2015 5:50 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Top DPS Class

by Theloras » Mon Nov 02, 2015 5:39 pm

Tseric said:
Wands are treated as an item, not a spell. +spell gear will affect any spells cast using mana, that originate from the caster, themselves. Wands can do extra damage if there is a resistance debuff on the creature (such as a fire resist debuff and a fire damage wand), but do not count as spells for the purposes you are describing.

http://forums.elitistjerks.com/forums/t ... -crit-hit/

PriestInOurTime, please reread carefully what Tseric said and then feel free to look up the countless number of items/weapon procs that scaled with spell damage in Vanilla - such as the following off the top of my head:

Shard of the Fallen Star
Binds when picked up
Trinket
Requires Level 60
Use: Calls down a meteor, burning all enemies within the area for 400 to 443 total Fire damage. (cooldown 3 min)
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=21891#wh-comments

Kalimdor's Revenge
Binds when picked up
Two-hand Sword
209 - 315 Damage Speed 3.20
(81.9 damage per second)
+24 Strength
+18 Stamina
Durability 120 / 120
Requires Level 60
Chance on hit: Instantly lightning shocks the target for 239 to 278 Nature damage.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=21679#wh-comments

Ancient Hakkari Manslayer
Binds when picked up
One-hand Axe
69 - 130 Damage Speed 2.00
(49.8 damage per second)
Durability 105 / 105
Requires Level 60
Chance on hit: Steals 48 to 55 life from target enemy.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=19852#wh-comments

Demon Forged Breastplate
Binds when equipped
Chest Plate
597 Armor
+12 Stamina
Durability 135 / 135
Requires Level 52
Equip: When struck has a 3% chance of stealing 0 life from the attacker over 4 sec.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=12628#wh-comments

Skullflame Shield
Binds when equipped
Off Hand Shield
2256 Armor
40 Block
+10 Fire Resistance
+10 Shadow Resistance
Durability 120 / 120
Requires Level 54
Equip: When struck in combat has a 3% chance of stealing 35 life from target enemy.
Equip: When struck in combat has a 1% chance of dealing 75 to 126 Fire damage to all targets around you.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=1168#wh-comments

Neretzek, The Blood Drinker
Binds when picked up
Two-hand Axe
202 - 303 Damage Speed 3.70
(68.2 damage per second)
+21 Strength
+16 Stamina
Durability 120 / 120
Requires Level 60
Chance on hit: Steals 141 to 164 life from target enemy.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=21856#wh-comments

Arcane Bomb
Requires Engineering (300)
Use: Drains 675 to 1126 mana from those in the blast radius and does 50% of the mana drained in damage to the target. Also Silences targets in the blast for 5 sec. (cooldown 1 min)
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=16040#wh-comments

Stratholme Holy Water
Binds when picked up
Use: Inflicts between 438 and 562 damage to Undead in a 10 yard radius. (cooldown 1 min)
"Just 1 calorie."
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=13180

"Used to scale with spell damage, making them extremely useful even in later content, but was finally nerfed in 2.4 to no longer do so."
http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Stratholme_Holy_Water

You get the idea...
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Re: Top DPS Class

by Theloras » Mon Nov 02, 2015 5:50 pm

Now here are the +fire/nature dmg items in question and their corresponding procs which unlike wands, are coded as INSTANT CAST SPELLS, therefore follow the standard spell damage scaling formula of 1.5 / 3.5 = 43% scaling:

Fiery Plate Gauntlets
Binds when equipped
Hands Plate
379 Armor
+10 Fire Resistance
Durability 45 / 45
Requires Level 53
Equip: Adds 4 fire damage to your weapon attack.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=12631

Fire Strike
30 yd range
Instant
Does 4 additional Fire damage to the target.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?spell=7714

Storm Gauntlets
Binds when equipped
Hands Mail
218 Armor
+7 Intellect
+10 Fire Resistance
Durability 40 / 40
Requires Level 54
Equip: Adds 3 Lightning damage to your melee attacks.
Equip: Increases damage done by Nature spells and effects by up to 21.

Lightning Strike
30 yd range
Instant
Does 3 additional Lightning damage to the target.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?spell=16614

Fiery Retributer
Binds when picked up
Unique
Main Hand Sword
56 - 105 Damage Speed 1.80
(44.7 damage per second)
60 Armor
+7 Strength
Durability 90 / 90
Requires Level 60
Equip: Increased Defense +5.
Equip: Adds 2 fire damage to your melee attacks.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=19968

Blazefury Medallion
Binds when picked up
Neck
+13 Agility
+14 Stamina
+12 Fire Resistance
Requires Level 60
Equip: Adds 2 fire damage to your melee attacks.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=17111

Fire Strike
30 yd range
Instant
Does 2 additional Fire damage to the target.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?spell=7712
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Re: Top DPS Class

by Theloras » Mon Nov 02, 2015 6:38 pm

Off-topic.
Last edited by Pottu on Mon Nov 02, 2015 8:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Off-topic
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Re: Top DPS Class

by shamwow » Tue Nov 10, 2015 3:41 pm

Setup wrote:
Theloras wrote:Reck Paladin trumps Warlock for sheer burst power


I was talking about PVE DPS.

For PVP, I'm not so sure. My warlock on feenix can do 11,000-14,000 damage in three seconds in a battleground. I know ret paladins can 1-shot me, but I'm pretty sure 11-14k in two globals isn't going to be beaten.




Even in a raid a non haste fully buffed paladin can do 1100 dps without mightstone.
Last edited by shamwow on Tue Nov 10, 2015 4:18 pm, edited 3 times in total.
This is how dark and evil a reckoning bomb paladin of Azeroth is
Imagine those people are stormwind citizens trapped
http://sendvid.com/0tfl74qq
Sapbomb/darkrune crits + spellcrit = 1-2 bombs
Image
youtube.com/watch?v=c8x76yI5_Jo
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Re: Top DPS Class

by shamwow » Tue Nov 10, 2015 3:42 pm

Off-topic
Last edited by Pottu on Wed Nov 11, 2015 7:27 pm, edited 9 times in total.
Reason: Spam
This is how dark and evil a reckoning bomb paladin of Azeroth is
Imagine those people are stormwind citizens trapped
http://sendvid.com/0tfl74qq
Sapbomb/darkrune crits + spellcrit = 1-2 bombs
Image
youtube.com/watch?v=c8x76yI5_Jo
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Re: Top DPS Class

by shamwow » Tue Nov 10, 2015 3:50 pm

Off-topic
Last edited by Pottu on Wed Nov 11, 2015 7:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Spam
This is how dark and evil a reckoning bomb paladin of Azeroth is
Imagine those people are stormwind citizens trapped
http://sendvid.com/0tfl74qq
Sapbomb/darkrune crits + spellcrit = 1-2 bombs
Image
youtube.com/watch?v=c8x76yI5_Jo
User avatar
shamwow
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