Priest Leveling Guide

Re: Priest Leveling Guide

by Brion » Tue Feb 02, 2016 6:02 pm

Ana wrote:
Brion wrote:It would do you well to try and phrase your criticisms more constructively.


To what end?

To the end that others are interested in your advice. If you're here stating your opinion, it's because you believe it's valid. If you want others to take it or you seriously, snide remarks work against that. You have to accept an agree to disagree scenario, especially since it's Fisher's guide.

Ana wrote:I already pretty much spelled out the issues with not taking healing focus (considering you're leveling in a forced PvP enviroment packed to bursting with members of the opposing faction).

It's not necessarily a PVP environment, as 20% of Nost is on the PVE server. I also agree with him about Healing Focus. I would rather focus on talents elsewhere, as it is a very real scenario where you can go several levels without fighting anyone that it's useful against. It's a decent talent, but not until after I have Meditation and Shadowform.

If you're going to argue for a situational talent that is PVP focused, I would say make it Martyrdom since it's in a tree you're working in anyway. Chances are that if you have to heal in a PVP scenario against physical dps, you have been crit, so you'll have 100% chance to avoid casting time loss and gain interruption resistance for all spells, not just holy.

Ana wrote:If, instead of having the points addressed, I'm going to get pure condescension as a reply, I have no reason to keep up the pretense on my end. I don't have infinite patience for people incapable of arguing coherently.
Also link from previous post.

He gave a response that the guide is focused on leveling efficiency rather than PVP concerns. Getting to Meditation/Mental Agility is more helpful than Healing Focus as those talents help in every single fight, where Healing Focus might help once in a while. The number of qualifiers for the talent being useful throws it into question:
If you are attacked
If you have a chance at fighting back (not a ?? ganker, not a group, etc)
If you have a need to heal
If you are able to cast the heal (kick/counterspell, CC'd, or just die too fast)
If it doesn't fail--it does have a 30% chance to do nothing.

Regarding your patience, you attack him in your very first post in the thread. Remember that it's not an argument, it's a discussion.
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Re: Priest Leveling Guide

by Ana » Tue Feb 02, 2016 6:35 pm

That's more like it.

Brion wrote:It's not necessarily a PVP environment, as 20% of Nost is on the PVE server.


Of course :P I'm taking PvP server POV here. I assume that people from PvE are clever enough to realise any talent advice relating to world PvP issues does not apply to them.

Brion wrote:I would rather focus on talents elsewhere, as it is a very real scenario where you can go several levels without fighting anyone that it's useful against.


Perhaps we play at different hours. It depends on the zone you're in, of course, but I've had numerous instances during leveling of being pretty much continuously under fire from the enemy faction. The choices are either change zone (which wastes a lot of time), die a lot (which wastes even more time) or be reliably capable of fending them off (still wastes time as you focus on fighting rather than questing, but infinitely faster than just dying over and over).

Brion wrote:If you're going to argue for a situational talent that is PVP focused, I would say make it Martyrdom


Yes, absolutely! I would actually go for both. Martyrdom is great but i.e. a mage can simply destroy you by just spamming arcane missiles, you can't do anything against that without Focus (I'm assuming CS is already down, otherwise healing in general is suicide unless it's bait).


Brion wrote:He gave a response that the guide is focused on leveling efficiency rather than PVP concerns.


I would say that avoiding numerous corpse runs boosts your leveling efficiency significantly :P
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Re: Priest Leveling Guide

by Fisher » Tue Feb 02, 2016 7:08 pm

I was more than happy to explain to Phyle why Healing Focus wasn't taken. What I'm not willing to do is tolerate the flaming and troll-like behavior, nor while I bother to tell you how to handle each and every specific PvP scenario as a priest in PvP. What I do if a rogue opens on me is irrelevant because...

This is a leveling guide.

If you want a PvP guide, maybe ask for one, or write one yourself! Yes, while leveling, you might encounter some gankers. However, I covered what to do when you get ganked: spend more mana to kill them faster.

I would ask that everyone from now on remain on-topic. If you have a question about the choices I made with my talents or my rotation, I'll answer. If you have a suggestion about how to level more efficiently, I'm willing to look into it. However, do not incite flamewars, do not bash each other, and do not talk about PvP, raiding, or which class is best. None of that matters here.
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Re: Priest Leveling Guide

by Sponza » Thu Feb 04, 2016 6:14 pm

Thanks for the guide Fisher, it'll surely help while leveling my priest. Some good info and tips I wasn't aware of. By the way, could you tell me why you've went with chance on hit instead chance to stun talent. It's true that sometimes you'll miss but on a PvP server I would go with my chances to stun a target.
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Re: Priest Leveling Guide

by Fisher » Thu Feb 04, 2016 11:39 pm

Sponza wrote:Thanks for the guide Fisher, it'll surely help while leveling my priest. Some good info and tips I wasn't aware of. By the way, could you tell me why you've went with chance on hit instead chance to stun talent. It's true that sometimes you'll miss but on a PvP server I would go with my chances to stun a target.


Having your spells resisted is still a possibility while leveling, and having to cast the same spell twice is a huge waste of mana, and you're really going to feel the hurt when key spells like Silence or Psychic Scream are resisted (especially in PvP, since that seems to be your concern). The stun is a random chance, and I still end up putting some points in it, but the talents are better spent on something that is consistently useful.
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Re: Priest Leveling Guide

by Phyle » Fri Feb 05, 2016 2:34 pm

Against you subjections I will play with healing fokus because of:

- Tanks are rare and not all are good enought to keep me out of damage all the time
- for mount cost reduction I need PvP Rank 3
- On a PvP server this talent saved me several times to survive ganks

For damage this talent is not helpful in the theory, but practical I need it.
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Re: Priest Leveling Guide

by Fisher » Fri Feb 05, 2016 2:44 pm

Phyle wrote:Against you subjections I will play with healing fokus because of:

- Tanks are rare and not all are good enought to keep me out of damage all the time
- for mount cost reduction I need PvP Rank 3
- On a PvP server this talent saved me several times to survive ganks

For damage this talent is not helpful in the theory, but practical I need it.


Well, I'm not here to dictate how you play, but I leveled on the PvP server, and I never once had to heal myself, even while being ganked, and I certainly never had to cast a healing spell while mobs/players were hitting me. If you intend to PvP as a healer, but remain specced for Shadow, then it might be worth taking. Otherwise, I don't see the point.

Regardless, you can do whatever you want. If you think Healing Focus will help you, feel free to spend your points on it.
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Re: Priest Leveling Guide

by Phyle » Fri Feb 05, 2016 3:07 pm

When you do not had to heal yourself you where very lucky^^ And after respeccing for shadow form it just delays the points for discipline for 2 levels. I do not think that this could be critical in any situation.
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Re: Priest Leveling Guide

by Forcerius » Sat Feb 06, 2016 8:40 pm

Great guide thank you. I can see by the way you speak that you're smart and logical. Don't waste time trying to educate idiots. They won't get it, no matter how clear the argument is. The person with the mage scenario is one example. You can't just say "Mage kills 30 mobs in 1 minute while priests kills 5 mobs, hurr durr see I just proved mages are better". Because that example would require actual math and testing to determine what's right. And there's no logical reason for a mage to level faster because they would have the same gear (wand), and spells that do about the same damage and still cost mana. I guarantee that I can kill a mob just as fast as a mage if I spam mind blast + SWP, with the nearly the same amount of mana. Except that mages lack spirit regen. So based on that alone, without real testing, a priest should level faster. The only problem with my example is that I didn't actually compare the damage / mana cost of the spells, because I just don't care enough to do that atm. But I know from playing my priest how much damage I do and how much mana it takes in general.
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Re: Priest Leveling Guide

by Ana » Sat Feb 06, 2016 11:19 pm

Forcerius wrote:I guarantee that I can kill a mob just as fast as a mage if I spam mind blast + SWP, with the nearly the same amount of mana.


I guarantee that you'll spend 2x more mana than the mage.
Someone's been bitching about lack of actual testing not 3 sentences earlier, I recall?

Gosh, I love how people whine about lack of logic and then proceed to throw in five fallacies within three sentences...


I actually butted in because I read through the OP's guide again and 2 things came to mind -

1. Which faction did you level in?
2. You list a bunch of wands best for specific levels. Half of them are BoE random drops. Do you honestly expect a leveling priest to spend dozens of gold pieces to get any of them at all? Because the general point about "good wand for your level for killing mobs fast" is kinda moot if you can't realistically afford most of them. 90% of leveling priests will be stuck with Gravestone Scepter until they get the green wand from STV, for instance (which isn't even good).
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