Paladin Tank Retail pre 1.9 patch

[smilkovpetko]

point is that "protection paladin" is made to be tank (where even following expansions made it clear who are the 3 tanks) , the reason why he use def cap , aggro by holy talent/spell and is also plate wearer + his talents increase "def" "parry" "threats" "armor"

this thing shamans don't have , nevertheless you can always do some other things and have more fun , but you should never compare frogs and rabbits .

Paladin Tank can Tank every single raid Boss that exist :

Evidence :

https://scontent-vie1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hp ... 8017_o.jpg

This Boss is technically the hardest Boss in game and Paladin did handle it , where shamans will not be able to do it.

[Dr. Doom]

point is that "protection paladin" is made to be tank (where even following expansions made it clear who are the 3 tanks) , the reason why he use def cap , aggro by holy talent/spell and is also plate wearer + his talents increase "def" "parry" "threats" "armor"

this thing shamans don't have , nevertheless you can always do some other things and have more fun , but you should never compare frogs and rabbits .

Paladin Tank can Tank every single raid Boss that exist :

Evidence :

https://scontent-vie1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hp ... 8017_o.jpg

This Boss is technically the hardest Boss in game and Paladin did handle it , where shamans will not be able to do it.

Shamans get talents for extra block, parry, extra dodge (paladins dont have that), and have natural high threat moves, seems to me it can work then,

If you want to be 100% efficient, then there is no need for any other tank other than protection warrior, except maybe if trash tanking numerous enemies is the point where paladins get a niche.

All the gear that you're wearing right now, all the recipes that you're needing (like the advanced armosmithing bits you're collecting) are str/stam/def gear better used in a warrior who is a naturally better tank. It is warrior gear.
Whether I'm, let's say 30% more inefficient than a warrior being a shaman tank, and you are 15% more inefficient as a paladin tank, is all a matter of gradation. You play protection paladin just cuz, not caring if you're a worse main tank for your team than a warrior. I'm just taking the philosophy even further.

[smilkovpetko]

well philosophy between prot warrior and prot paladin we can just argue but let not start that.

i'd say yeah i like to see different things , but what i am talking i have already experienced and done 10 years in row. where we are able possibly with "warrior offtank taunting on certain fights only" to maintank every possible Boss in game , also keep in mind Def Cap where is mandatory , i am not sure how Shamans would catch that but i'd agree with you since there exist in game 2hand weapons that gives parry etc or i am wrong ?

[Killstick]

The point is; everyone sees warriors as the vanilla tanks. He wants to be the special snowflake portection paladin.
If you also make become a special snowflake tank with Spriest/Shaman hell even durid he won't be special anymore and 10y of life down the drain.

I think shaman and Spriest might actually tank better than pala's considering all their bugs and Nost dev very low interest to spend time fixing paladin bugs.

[justclassic]

In terms of maintanking a raidboss paladins only have 2 real disadvantages over warriors.

1. Warriors get a -10% dmg buff (including magic dmg) from def stance. Paladins dont have a compareable buff that is exclusive for them.

2. Warriors can become crush immune for at least 2 blows every 5 seconds. Paladins can't.

A possible third could be taunt, but it isnt needed everywhere and also taunt got some weaknesses (resist f.e.).

[smilkovpetko]

In terms of maintanking a raidboss paladins only have 2 real disadvantages over warriors.

1. Warriors get a -10% dmg buff (including magic dmg) from def stance. Paladins dont have a compareable buff that is exclusive for them.

2. Warriors can become crush immune for at least 2 blows every 5 seconds. Paladins can't.

A possible third could be taunt, but it isnt needed everywhere and also taunt got some weaknesses (resist f.e.).

nobody can get immune crash , maybe you should start investigating deeper , everyone def cap have equal chance to eat 15% crush , no matter how much avoidance you got

[Memegank]

He is referring to shield block (+75% block chance for the next 2 attacks), this will push crushing blows off the attack table for the next 2 hits for most warriors with some level of gear.

[justclassic]

In terms of maintanking a raidboss paladins only have 2 real disadvantages over warriors.

1. Warriors get a -10% dmg buff (including magic dmg) from def stance. Paladins dont have a compareable buff that is exclusive for them.

2. Warriors can become crush immune for at least 2 blows every 5 seconds. Paladins can't.

A possible third could be taunt, but it isnt needed everywhere and also taunt got some weaknesses (resist f.e.).

nobody can get immune crash , maybe you should start investigating deeper , everyone def cap have equal chance to eat 15% crush , no matter how much avoidance you got

Sure you can become crush immune.

All your avoidance values added together need to be bigger than 102,4%. Then you are crush immune.

Warriors have 5% Dodge, Miss and 10% parry, block with prot-spec: 30% .

If they now use shield-block they have (+75% block): 105% Avoidance making them crushimmune for atleast 2 hits. Since Dodge, parry and miss dont consume a shield block stack this becomes even better with better gear.

Paladins have Holy Shield but it only gives 30% additional block which is not enough (not even in BiS) to become crush immune.

[smilkovpetko]

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Crushing_ ... did=314477

When the attacker is 3 or more levels above its target, there is a 15% minimum chance of being struck by a crushing blow.

If a player's defense is lower than the maximum for that level, the crushing blow chance is increased. However, having extra defense past the cap for that level does not lower the crushing blow chance any further.

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Defense?oldid=238467

Revision as of 18:14, September 8, 2006

[Memegank]

Yes, but that 15% chance can be reduced by avoidance. Parry / dodge / block take a higher precedence than crushing blows on the attack table.

102.4% is the avoidance cap. When your cumulative Dodge, Parry and Block (+ 5% Boss miss) equal or exceed 102.4%, You are now un-hittable by normal attacks (either crushing or normal hits). In this case, the boss will either miss or you will dodge, parry, or block the attack. Blocked attacks cannot be crushing blows and therefore you cannot be crushed in this case.

For example: someone who is at 440 defense with 18% dodge, 17% parry, 22% block as their base avoidance gets the following attack table from a boss.
Miss: 5.00%
Dodge: 18.00%
Parry: 17.00%
Glancing Blow: 0.00%
Block: 22.00%
Critical hit: 0.00%
Crushing Blow: 15.00%
Ordinary hit: 25.40%

Now lets say it's a warrior who uses shield block (+75% chance to dodge for 5 seconds or 2 attacks):
Miss: 5.00%
Dodge: 18.00%
Parry: 17.00%
Glancing Blow: 0.00%
Block: 97.00% (22 + 75)
Critical hit: 0.00%
Crushing Blow: 0.00%
Ordinary hit: 0.00%
Block chance takes precedence over crushing blows and ordinary hits and is now so large that it has pushed them both off the attack table and therefore CANNOT happen.

Same situation for a defense capped paladin with the same avoidance stats using holy shield (+30% chance to block):
Miss: 5.00%
Dodge: 18.00%
Parry: 17.00%
Glancing Blow: 0.00%
Block: 52.00% (22 + 30)
Critical hit: 0.00%
Crushing Blow: 10.40%
Ordinary hit: 0.00%
Here, the extra block chance has pushed ordinary hits off the attack table but the paladin's total avoidance has only reached 92% and therefore this leaves 10.4% to be accounted for, which will always end up being crushing blows if the boss does not miss or the paladin does not dodge / parry / block.